Conversations with a (non) Vegan: disconnect, dissonance and excuses

In these posts I offer an open and honest insight into real life conversations I've had with non-Vegans.

I feel the need to analyse how I talk to and approach non-Vegans because I want to improve the way in which I communicate with other humans all the time... I'm never arrogant enough to think I know it all.

So I add this here as a learning tool for me and for anyone else who's interested.

This conversation was held a couple of months ago - there are many changes I would make, and have made, to my approach since! 
Hindsight is wonderful, continuous improvement is imperative :)

But, as always, I welcome your thoughts, constructive feedback and suggestions - for this is how we learn to get positive debate started and to open hearts and minds. Thank you.

Much love Chantal xx

DM convo on Twitter (transcribed word for word)

non-Vegan

me

what I could have added with hindsight

thoughts

[I had just followed this person on Twitter]

Thank you for the follow, i'm afraid I'm not a vegan but love salad!!! : )

thats ok! i follow non vegans too! u might even find we eat a lot more than salad and you're tempted?!

although if you love animals - you know what i might say to you dont you??!!

Yes i know what you're going to say!! I do love animals you can see how much by my piccies of my [dogs] : )

(aw yes beautiful) but you don't love all animals though..... :(

What do you mean not all animals?

well you love your dogs, but don't love other animals because u still eat them, use products from them?

Not necessarily, i do love animals, i eat them but it doesn't mean i don't feel guilty[C1] . I refuse to buy purses, coats, etc made from animal

aww i can understand that hun - i used to feel the same - thats why i did eventually make that change, first veggie, finally vegan... it took me a little time - but i cant tell u how much better it made me feel - partly because of that guilt,... when i knew what really went on with farming and products it kind of shocked me into it... :(

Don't get me wrong it's not something i don't agree on - being a veggie/vegan but my argument stems from our ancestors ate meat that they Had to fight/hunt for. If they wanted veg they'd eat that too as part of a staple diet. But animals themselves are foragers of meat too And some animals eat us humans too[C2] . There's no one out there telling them not to eat us. I don't think the WAY animals are killed for our Consumption is right nor fair but it happens[C3] . In fact theres some veg that I don't like eg; peppers, mushrooms, leek etc. so I'd starve if I didn't eat meat[C4] . If it helps i make sure the meat i eat isn't imported but it's from our soil. So that way i know that they've been Slaughtered "fairly[C5] "

wow - um define slaughtered fairly? Sadly there can be no such thing... r humans murdered fairly? Location makes no difference.

I tweeted u some info... unable to link here [viva: Cruel Britannia video]

I understand all of the history & arguments ppl make for eating meat - at the end of the day we dont NEED to eat it to survive these days so therefore - why would I? I prefer not to. And when u take it away the choice of foods actually opens up! there is so much u CAN eat! :)

[plus science proves its killing us early and meat, dairy, egg industries are destroying the environment]

Okay i take back the last statement, fairly wasn't the correct word, when i said that i meant humanely perhaps? Not beaten up then throat  Slit, i also don't agree with battery hens but yes I do still eat chickens[C6] . But as a meat eater there is probably a fine line between what I think is right for me as a human and what veggie's say is right. But i will defend my right to eat meat, as it is my choice. I'm sorry If that offends people that's not what im here to do.

[why are you sorry if you think you are doing the right thing?][Is it really a choice if you are being told to eat it by society, farming industry, clever marketing?]

killing can never be humane - intensive farming & slaughter methods r horrific - please watch that video and you'll see

well u say its 'your right' but what about the rights of other species? u dont offend me - i was YOU two years ago...!!

Yes other animals have a right [C7] but one voice alone is not going to stop the world killing/abusing animals[C8] . I'm not selfish but tbh i don't  Eat loads of meat i do love pasta too. But i'm not going to stop eating meat, idk why I'm just not going to stop it.

ah but if everyone used the 'one voice alone cant do anything' then nothing would change for the better! individuals end up forming a collective! more and more ppl are choosing to look at things differently and its so much easier these days.. so many gr8 alternative products 

i'll leave you in peace now! lets just say you know where i am if u want 2 discuss more!! :) im always happy 2 help & can share info

I've seen that video b4 and as much as it makes my blood boil i'm not going to take meat out of my diet. In fact where i live there is a Massive pig farm and the pigs are free range with their shelters it's v refreshing to see. I'm sorry if i've offended/upset you. 

[if you’ve seen that video how can you say that buying British is a guarantee of ‘more humane’ slaughter?]

---

 [C1]So u know its wrong?

 [C2]Which ones? Not many? And to survive or protect, but we don’t need to do that

 [C3]Again, u show you know its wrong

 [C4]Really! There are ##types of veg, ##types of salad ##types of grains & I can show u 365 b’fasts, lunches & dinners u could enjoy!

 [C5]Contradicts above – I don’t think its right or fair

 [C6]Hence the guilt?

 [C7]So don’t take that away from them

 [C8]But u could save ### animals a year just on your own!

When a non-vegan says they feel guilty for eating meat this is a clear admission of the fact that they feel it's ethically wrong. The fact that this lady said she avoids other animal products shows just what a strong disconnect people have with their food and just how ingrained our cultural norm for eating meat is. What then followed were classic examples of excuses and justifications for eating meat (cognitive dissonance) - 'our ancestors did', 'humans are meant to hunt', animals eat 'humans', 'consumption happens anyway', 'I don't like some veg so I'd starve',  etc. The arguments of starvation without meat continue to prove how little people understand of the Vegan diet and all of the possibilities for varied healthy eating within it. Messages about this still haven't got through to people successfully.

What was also evident here was the belief that British meat is more 'fairly' reared and slaughtered - hence continued lack of knowledge and also justification for actions.

Interestingly, this lady went on to acknowledge that animals have rights but again reverts to a justification 'one person can't make a difference' i.e. the peer pressure prevails - proving it's easier to go with the majority. But again she tries to allay some of her guilt by saying that she 'doesn't eat much meat'.

End thoughts:

You'll see that I ended the conversation first on this occasion. This is because whilst I knew I had put some logical counter-arguments to her, I felt that I'd pushed too far and that she'd reached a point of becoming defensive of her actions to me.

2 hours later I received this message:

Hi again. You took Me by surprise this eve. I know you've got a point to put across, i appreciate that but my opinions are still my own : ) having said that, you have made me think

I didn't reply - because I felt that this lady had now actually reached a point of reflection. Studies show that for someone to fully absorb an important message they need to hear it 7 times. I think this lady is probably mid way in that set of messages. And even if I can help one person to think differently next time they tuck into a roast pork dinner or pass that field of 'happy' pigs then I know I'm doing my bit to contribute to those 7 vital times of hearing something important.

I note she stopped following me - because the truth is hard to bear and I know my timeline will make difficult reading for many non-Vegans.

But I also know that I was her just two years ago and that people can change once they are given a chance and the truth of what's really going on out there is presented to them. 

Every conversation is an important one. So I'll keep trying my best.

Chantal D-H has studied psychology as part of her dual degree studies at MSc level and has 21 years experience of communications/team/people management in diverse customer-facing environments.